Marty Hayes

by Marty Hayes, J.D.

April was very interesting! My month included a month-long motorhome journey with my dog to Oklahoma to attend a training course, which has what I believe could possibly be profound implications in self-defense cases. I’ll tell you more about that course next month. The trip started with a week in North Idaho visiting my 91-year-old mother, who is doing great, I am happy to note.

During the first days of my visit with Mom, I was sucker-punched by Marc J. Victor, an Arizona attorney who runs a unique self-defense legal program called Attorneys on Retainer. I wasn’t physically sucker-punched mind you, but attacked by a competitor in the legal arena who I thought was a friend, trying to make profit by telling mistruths and making misleading statements on YouTube about the Network.

In case you didn’t see his video, here's the link to his video Armed Citizens' Legal Defense Network (ACLDN) Policy Review By Attorney Marc J. Victor . I continue to work while traveling, so we put together a make-shift film studio at my mom’s and filmed a response that we titled ACLDN Responds to Marc J Victor you can view by clicking the title.

Sm No AOR copyWhen Victor first started presenting on YouTube, he was exposing the self-defense insurance programs for their lack of candor about how the insurance underwriter actually controls their funding for a self-defense case. I felt this was a good move. This type of promotion is not personally my style, but I can say I welcomed public discussion of those issues. He had a program which on first blush seemed like a reasonable approach to the need to get legal representation after an incident. I even visited him when I was traveling in Arizona last fall.

I was interested in his approach but came to change my mind. It seems that not too many other people believed what he said about the Network, either. We decided to keep track and counted six members who dropped out of the Network after his attack. Although none named his video as the reason, the timing makes it seem possible. We did find it a little funny when several new members cited the Attorneys on Retainer video as their reasons for joining us.

Members have asked me if it is possible to sue for Victor’s conduct in the video. Perhaps. When I was taking tort law in law school, we studied the concept of intentional interference with contractual relationships. (To learn more, read which explains it pretty well.) When a competitor misleads people in order to interfere with another’s business, and does in fact interfere with a contractual relationship, that opens the potential for a lawsuit. In our case, there is very little in the way of damages, so it is not worth the time and energy to pursue a claim. I wonder about some of the other companies which took larger hits, who likely are pondering lawsuits.

At one time, I explored forming some type of working relationship with Attorneys on Retainer, although I couldn’t find enough common ground for us to work together. Of course, that’s off the table now. Network members living in Arizona have access to many other good attorneys who in my opinion would do a good or better job for them. Whether you live in Arizona or elsewhere, the advice we’ve given from the beginning to find a good attorney who is local to your area still has merit.

After a self-defense incident, you do not need a voice on the phone giving you “legal advice.” What you need is the attorney who can show up at the police station (or even as we saw happen in one of our member-involved cases, an attorney speaking for you at the shooting scene) to interact with the police, news media and later the prosecution. Network members should already know how to handle the immediate aftermath of a self-defense incident, but it is a good time for a refresher, so browse to and watch Don’t Talk to the Police? Massad Ayoob's 5 Points after a Self-Defense Shooting.

I could go on, but since the Network’s work on behalf of members remains as solid as ever, there’s no need for repetition. Let’s call it good.

I hope to see you all at the Dallas NRA Annual Meeting, where we will once again have a booth. Please come visit with us in Booth 8247 in the exhibit hall of the Kay Bailey Hutchison Convention Center in Dallas, TX from May 17-19, 2024.

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